Joe Biden didn’t just win the debate. Joe Biden invented a new way to debate liars.

Dude totally got Bidened…

The epic performance last night by Vice President Joe Biden is destined to go down in history as one of the finest debate showings ever. Three things conspired against Congressman Paul Ryan: the truth, a debate opponent well prepared with facts and a ‘tude, and a debate moderator that was skilled and educated enough not to put up with any bullshit. This perfect storm left Ryan flopping on the beach like a fish, mouth gawping for air, completely knocked out of his zone.

It’s not easy to debate someone who tells lie after lie after lie. You risk spending your entire time refuting the lies without ever getting your own message out. Last night, Joe Biden taught us how to do it. He started out grinning whenever Ryan lied. By the end, he was openly laughing and, in what was almost like a live-tweeting of his own debate, responded in the background to each lie that rolled out of Ryan’s mouth with a refutation so that, when it was his own turn, he could actually deliver his message.

He made Ryan look foolish on foreign policy. He made Ryan look foolish on domestic policy. He made Ryan look almost irreligious on the question of abortion. And the entire time, he was openly derisive of Ryan when he lied. It was a pitch perfect performance.

Here’s a classic example in a discussion about defense. By the end, confronted with direct questions, Ryan was stumbling and saying they won’t increase defense spending (which directly contradicts Mitt Romney on this topic):

Here’s Biden on the abortion question:

Perhaps the most enjoyable moment was when Biden pointed out Ryan’s hypocrisy on the Stimulus, telling us that he got not one but TWO letters from Ryan asking for Stimulus money for his state. Why? Because it would create jobs!

This is how you handle liars. You show the perfect amount of derision for someone who is lying to the American people and then refute his lies with facts, openly, aggressively and with humor.

When I defended President Obama’s debate performance last week, I said that it freed him up to be more aggressive in the next debate because people were expecting him to. What I didn’t consider is that it also freed up Vice President Biden to do the same thing. Biden was already in the role of being more of an aggressor but, after last week, nearly everyone paying attention to the debates was saying he’d have to come out swinging. And, wow, did he ever.

He has shown us a new way to contend with politicians who have based their entire campaign on lies. You just have to Biden them.

  • zizi2

    Right on the mark. Great insights

  • Ebogan63

    Good points.

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Betty-Porter/100000128330579 Betty Porter

    Romney/Ryan are honest! Obama’s plan is more of the same, which gets worse as we go.

    • http://eclectablog.com Eclectablog

      You really need to come to this site armed with facts or you’re going to be exposed for your foolishness by my well-informed readers. Every single economic indicator that you can name is headed in the right direction. Every. Single. One. What Mitt Romney and Paul Ryan want to do is take is back to what we absolutely KNOW does not work and that, in fact, drive is into the deep ditch we are in in the first place.
      Please, if you are going to comment here, do yourself a favor and use facts to support your position. Otherwise, you just end up looking very foolish.

      • http://sucktackular.com sucktackular

        No response from @facebook-100000128330579:disqus? Color me entirely unsurprised.

      • http://twitter.com/ConleyBrown Conley Brown

        Why? Your article doesn’t have any facts and neither did the VP which is why all he could do was force an awkward fake laugh and make himself look dumb. I suppose you hold your opposition to a higher standard than you hold yourself.

        • Anonymous

          Flip and reverse your statement. Are you deaf, or did you just mentally ill away all of the facts Biden presented?

      • matthc

        How about the civilian employment population ratio? Or is Greg Mankiw esteemed chairman of the economics department at Harvard a biased right leaning idiot?

        http://gregmankiw.blogspot.com/2012/10/monitoring-recovery.html

        • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100001265775611 H.e. Doctoroncologistmd Woods

          I appreciate the graph and the position of the graph provider, but where is Greg taking his samples from? The midwest was a pit of double digit percentage unemployment before 2008 – I remember, I was looking for a job from 2004-2007, with a great skillset for today’s economy, but back then there weren’t any jobs. Midwest is almost entirely manufacturing and agricultural jobs, so yeah it’s going to shrivel up if these jobs are given to the cheapest individual/shipped overseas. It’s great to think that private sector jobs could move into the midwest easily enough, but most trend towards areas of high culture and population density. Point of fact, what the graph shows me is that the Bush administration formally tanked the economy towards the end of Bush’s presidency, and that Obama has done a good job of stabilizing the downward fall. Considering the lifecycle of a new bill, it wouldn’t be until late 2009 to early 2010 that anything Obama had attempted to do would become at all apparent.

          Companies in cultural areas and culture in areas with big companies feed into eachother in a way that draws promising talent and educational resources out of less interesting, less dense areas, making them further less interesting and less dense. The best thing companies can do for an economy shifting away from manufacturing is to move into the midwest and establish a will to grow these under-cultured, under-educated areas. Your average person has untold potential that gets easily squandered and wasted away without an achievable goal to reach for, and overpopulation in coastal cities drives up cost of living intensely. America is huge – spread it out.

          Regarding the article – I haven’t watched either debate, but I generally will vote for the candidate most likely to join the rest of the industrialized world in establishing solid foundations for some kind of universal healthcare program, and the one that will not be looking to start wars with anyone any time soon. This is currently Obama by a landslide! I have no interest in a party that would repeal the current healthcare plan to replace it with one that pays into the already bloated privatized insurance system in America. “they create jobs!” and so can government healthcare programs – there are plenty of solid avenues to explore for job growth without selling your soul to a health insurance company.

          To be fair I’ve heard a lot of meme repetition and latching on to popular ideas in the quotes from both sides – where what they’re saying doesn’t influence what we think, but what we think influences what they say. The internet is a great tool, but it’s also a tool that the candidates can and are using to increase the loyalty of their respective parties. That’s why I haven’t been listening to the debates – it makes me feel cheap when I see a facebook meme from one to three months ago being used as a platform by someone I’m meant to respect and trust with this country.

          Cheaper still when tired memes on both sides are used by constituents as though they are genuine political positions, e.g. socialist Obama and Romney’s liking to fire people. I’d just like to see both sides be a bit smarter, a bit less keen on latching onto complete bullshit media spin. We’ve lived in a country shaped by televised media for over half a century now – have we really not grown desensitized? are we really still buying whatever we hear on tv?

    • CADEM

      Stop embarrassing yourself and proving once again home
      school is not effective.

    • Jar1980

      This is the equvalent of the lady calling Obama a communist and then not being able to explain what a communist is or even what she felt in this context. This is the opitomy of just being a sheep following what people tell you to follow with zero idea of what you’re talking about. And even if you don’t know what you’re talking about and someone comes and calls you on it, do yourself a favour and go read something and get some facts and an opinion to arm yourself with. Posting BEFORE you do this results in this pointless post.

      • grantham

        brush up on your vocabulary. I agree with you but it’s hard to take you seriously when you can’t spell epitome.

    • Anonymous

      Don’t worry, Betty OBVIOUSLY has no idea what she is talking about. Probably a mindless puppet. More of the same with Obama? What about more of the same policies which caused our current situation from Mitt? Oh wait, she is aware of neither.

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Betty-Porter/100000128330579 Betty Porter

    I want a job, not food stamps.

    • Turk February

      Funny, I’m an Obama supporter that has a job, a house, and would be considered upper middle class. How about you stop waiting on the government to create jobs and make yourself valuable on your own? Romney/Ryan are honest, give me a break. I sound like a conservative here but people like this waiting on the government to create jobs sound worse then the people on food stamps. If you can’t get a job in this market you have a terrible skill set. It’s your fault, don’t blame Obama.

      • anon

        you are so off base it’s laughable. there are plenty of professional, well-educated, unemployed people in this country who are not lazy or “have a terrible skill set”. we are in a recession. this is a huge part of the problem with this country. everyone assumes too much. when did it become us vs. them? i feel like the debates are dividing people based on income and that isn’t the way our country should function.

        • MargaretEDavis

          Yes an he won’t be so hard of everybody else if one of the conservative owned companies upped and sent his job overseas like the rest. Has he not heard that Romney is responsible for most of the good jobs gone. He bought companies, sold the assets, stole the pensions , fired the employees and sent the jobs overseas. And there is a company that Bain is doing the same thing to , right now, in Illinois.

          • Matt

            This is absolutely ludicrous. I can’t believe you are actually blaming Romney for all the jobs that have been lost. First you blamed bush( not the housing market) and now you’re blaming someone who actually has no control over the economy. You have no concept of how a private equity firm works ( they make money by removing inefficient management to increase SHAREHOLDER VALUE) and you have no concept of how a global economy functions. Shipping jobs overseas is a direct result of globalization ( the ability of another to perform your functions more efficiently) and actually results in increased wealth for everyone. You should be glad that there is a company like that in Illinois, because they are reducing crony management practices and help transition America into a service economy (which generally results in higher standard of living than a traditional manufacturing economy provided you have an education.

          • Jen Klein

            Well put Margaret. Glad to see someone on here uses their brain.

          • http://www.facebook.com/people/Robin-Salvadori-Allison/1516112677 Robin Salvadori Allison

            A service economy results in a higher standard of living?
            http://www.forbes.com/sites/stevedenning/2012/01/31/is-the-us-in-a-phase-change-to-the-creative-economy/

            A service economy is certainly one looming possibility for the US
            economy, but a service economy per se is unlikely to be an American
            success story.If all American workers do is mow lawns, cut hair, export raw materials,
            and market and sell goods manufactured in other countries, the wealth
            of the nation is unlikely to be great.”

            I do notice you tout increasing shareholder value, rather than company value. Two different beasts. Mr. Romney is on tape talking about harvesting maximum value within 5-8 years. Selling the whole thing gets maximum value SHORT TERM for shareholders, while growing the company will give maximum value long term.

        • Temp1

          As Ryan pointed it out the Republican plan would take 10 years to reach 6% unemployment. They are criticizing Obama for being unable to create the amount of jobs 4 years that they claim will take THEMSELVES 10 years to do…

    • Michiganmitch

      And in the meantime would you prefer starving? Romney’s trickle down and budget cutting will cost jobs, not create them, and end your foodstamps. I bet you think that cutting debt and deficits and tax cuts for the wealthy creates jobs. Care to explain how and cite an example of when this has EVER taken place in a demand-based recession?

      • MargaretEDavis

        Of course in his speech about the 37% he said…..people are not entitled to food.

      • Matt

        I don’t feel like any educated individual needs an explanation on how unless your spending is creating nominal growth that exceeds the rate at which you’re borrowing it’s generally a bad idea. In regards to everything else, here you go. http://media.reason.com/mc/_external/2012_10/click-through-for-full-article.png?h=418&w=500
        Note: I’m a libertarian so I hate both candidates, but to argue that we don’t need massive spending cuts across the board (military and welfare programs especially) is asinine.

        • Michiganmitch

          Matt- You have a poor understanding of economics. According to economist Dean Baker, we were just fine with deficits preceding the collapse of the housing bubble. Addressing a result of an occurrence (high deficits) rather than the cause the cause ( an unregulated financial sector) is idiotic. Massive spending cuts at this time are at the least ill-advised and realistically potentially disastrous. If you want the Great Depression 2.0, austerity is the answer!!!

    • zeppy

      Food stamps actually help millions of people around the country get back on their feet, but you wouldn’t know that because you are too busy watching FOX “news.”

    • Eric Zehnder

      The way the President could create jobs is if he actually took control of industries like Oil and Pharmaceutical companies and used those massive profits to hire people. That does happen, though, because we are a capitalist society. The free markets have decided how many people they need to hire based on a massive number of factors.

      The President can only do so much to encourage growth or make the country attractive to companies – if you want to be pissed at somebody be pissed at Wall Street, Big Banks, and companies that take jobs overseas. These have been shown time and again to have caused our previous recessions/depressions and lack of jobs (respectively).

      • MargaretEDavis

        The reason the gas prices are so high in this country is those oil rich and loaded with money companies mainly the Koch Bros are speculating on wall street. And the republicans and the idiots who listen to Fox are blaming the President to do some thing. He could, he could nationalize the oil industry and some of the others, but what would happen to the republicans then if he did. They can’t have it both ways ..they would never want the govenment to seize control of these industries. But they still rant and rave because he doesn’t control prices.

    • jar1980

      This is the opposite of informative. You want people to support your side of the argument then you have to actually MAKE an argument. Reasons, people. If you’re uneducated on the reasons why you’re voting Romney, you shouldn’t vote for either. Don’t vote because you feel you should and you hate one guy. Vote and debate based on things you KNOW. If you don’t know, you don’t have a right to argue for either side. Read something and think, please.

    • MargaretEDavis

      You aren’t making enough noise and tell Boehner to release the bills. He has every single solitary one of the jobs presented by the Democrats and the ones President Obama wanted sitting on Boehners desk. That is the ones Boehner hasn’t already thrown in the trash can. If you and those that want jobs would yell at the press for surpressing this information they might have to tell the country that the republcians are obstructing jobs.

    • Hal

      Get one. If you are not skilled for the jobs open, get training. I know companies very short handed who can’t find qualified applicants.

      http://education.yahoo.net/articles/where_are_the_jobs_now.htm?kid=1LSRB&utm_source=&utm_medium=&utm_campaign=

    • http://www.facebook.com/Kurt.Cooper.1453 Kurt Cooper

      The two are not mutually exclusive. Millions of employed people like those who work at Walmart need food stamps to help feed their family because wages have not kept pace with inflation let alone productivity growth. We have an inequality that would embarass Queen Victoria and until thats solved too many people will need help.

    • Siobhan

      So, you don’t have a job? Well then get off your lazy arse and go out and get one!

  • gbutton

    Great points, though is this really the invention of a new debating tactic (that’s not rhetoric if you have sources I’d love it.) Also, a spelling thing “Perhaps the must enjoyable moment “, must should be most. Great article, keep up the good work!

    • http://eclectablog.com Eclectablog

      Thanks for the edit!

    • http://www.facebook.com/amy.washburn Amy Washburn

      A grammar thing – your first sentence requires a closing punctuation mark, preferably a question mark. If you’re going to criticize others, please take care to be perfect. ;)

  • Jase

    i love joe biden

    • austin thorpey

      everytime in the past, when they said he made a gaffe, He usually said something I could see myself saying….So, THATS why people like him, because he really doesnt stand on pretension. You can say he lacks class all day, but who of us really do act “classy” all the time? Most of us say what we mean.

      • rmthunter

        You have to think about who’s saying he “lacks class” — people who live in mortal terror of not being invited to one of Sally Quinn’s parties.

  • Daisee

    It wasn’t a real debate w/o Justice/Green and Socialist candidates. Wall Street chose your candidates, only the 1% will win by their actions. The working people and the illusory middle class all lost. Rotten system and corrupt to the core and has failed everyone.

    • jar1980

      rhetoric helps.
      /sarcasm

    • http://www.facebook.com/nickdrakewhat Nick Drake

      That is so insightful of you, but please don’t say anything ever again.

  • Biden the Loser

    Not one good point in the entire article. It just proves that the only way to deal with the truth about the utter failure of your administration is to laugh and act superior. The only lies on that stage were from Biden. He is the most incompetent AP in the history of the country. Which makes sense since he works for the most incompetent president in history.

    • Quae Nulla Fortuna

      Dang. Obama is worse than Warren G. Harding, Calvin Coolidge, James Buchanan, and Dubya?

      • http://www.facebook.com/corky.skitson Corky Skitson

        lol James Buchanon, our first gay president.

    • Ben

      Just out of curiosity… how do you not suffocate when your head is so damn deep up your own ass?

    • jar1980

      Any facts or opinions that are based on information or just “they’re lying and he’s bad”. Why? Why is he bad? Why is he the worst in the histroy of the country? We need specifics regarding what decisions Joe Biden has made that have reduced the quality of living for a majority of the country. Since that’s kind of the whole point to your comment. So…

      • matth

        I’ve posted two comments to help explain how “shipping jobs overseas” is actually a good thing for our country and how spending cuts must be made alongside tax increase, but my posts have been removed immediately. While I doubt the lack of bias of the poster “Biden the Loser”, I sincerely doubt any “lies” made by Joe Biden would remain on this page for more than 5 minutes.

        • http://eclectablog.com Eclectablog

          Are you accusing me of deleting comments simply because I disagree with them? I have never done that unless the person was offensive to me or other commenters. You need to watch making allegations like that because you have nothing to support them.

    • Bleau

      “The only lies on that stage were from Biden.” Not according to fact checkers…

    • MargaretEDavis

      BS from the republicans begets BS from republicans. That’s ALL YOU HAVE BS.

    • Anonymous

      I guess this is another one of those invalids who provides no reasons, no answers, silence and maneuvers when faced with facts, and focuses on how someone acted versus the substance of what they said, i.e., current republican supporter. But don’t worry, this person does not benefit from ANY of the policies Obama put into office, oh wait, they have no idea what they were and what their effects were. Typical.

    • Siobhan

      Don’t be jealous.

  • JimmyNelson

    You had me at Joe..

  • SCB

    biden had me at malarkey

  • Pingback: the v.p. debate round-up « hip is everything

  • MargaretEDavis

    Oh dear and the republicans are messing them selves all over the place because we won’t say that Lyin Ryan won the debate. I mean after all Fox and it’s sister want to be CNN both said so. And Fox had me laughing on the floor when they said Biden wasn’t polite and tried to over talk poor little Ryan. Gee maybe Biden watched some of the republcian guest Fox has when they won’t let one of the Democrats say a word.

    • concerned american

      wake up margaret. you have been lied to for 4 yrs….

      • http://www.tommyjonestheband.com RantingTommy

        We’ve all been lied to by the MSM that is desperate to make this election close and will cheerlead for Rmoney every day until the election.

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Christian-Baptiste/623013594 Christian Baptiste

    Exactly! Well put.

  • Bubbles

    Its hard to make a decent arguement when the mediator is pro-one candidate and ends up preventing the candidates from having equal opportunity to respond to questions. #Bullshit@VPDebate

    • Anonymous

      #republicanspreventALLequalopportunities

    • Jad

      So, when a Republican loses the debate, it’s the moderator’s fault? Interesting. I’m pretty sure that no matter how you twist it, the winning side has to have some facts and figures to back up why they are correct. Biden did, plain and simple. Ryan was caught in some less than true statements, some that even went against his Presidential candidates running platform. I’m pretty sure that when you do that, no matter how pro-one candidate a moderator may be, you will be perceived as the loser.

    • Gigi

      Sour grapes, dude. Sour grapes.

  • realityisoverated

    1. Go to google.com.
    2. Type in “mathematically impossible”.
    3. Hit enter.
    4. Laugh!

    • Dale Top

      Too funny

    • Nathalie Jones

      When you do an image search for that same phrase, it’s even BETTER! rofl

  • http://twitter.com/stellacadente stellacadente

    Nobody puts Biden in a corner!

    • http://eclectablog.com Eclectablog

      FTW!

  • http://www.facebook.com/Bobbied100 Bobbie Dunn

    It is the traditional ‘job’ of the VP candidate to be the ‘bulldog’. If Obama had come out swinging at Mittens, they would have yelled ANGRY BLACK MAN! and this way Mitt got to paint himself as a total TOOL. Now after Rope a dope in round one, Obama wil tag him in round Two and DECK Mitt in Round 3!

    • austin thorpey

      EXACTLY. They are adapting to the rules as they are, so he has free reigns to give it Romney (who DOES know how to debate, you have to give him that). But, I wouldnt underestimate Obama’s ability to bring a can of whoop ass to the engagement, I dont know why people still underestimate him.

      • concerned american

        HE IS A LIAR! LOOK UP THE FACTS PEOPLE

        • Cthulhu818

          One notices that you don’t have any facts to present, and all you can do is stand on the sidelines shouting stupidity.

    • http://www.facebook.com/CathySmith5 Cathy Smith

      Exactly!

  • http://twitter.com/ConleyBrown Conley Brown

    I suppose being “Bidened” refers to when your opponent interrupts you 82 times in one debate, hardly letting you get a word in edgewise, all the while complaining that HE isn’t getting enough time (and then it turns out he talks 2 minute longer than you do). When he’s not busy doing that he’s forcing out an awkward fake laugh or doing the “cranky old man” routing, failing to address why his administration should be given a second chance after four years of failing policies.

    • Anonymous

      So a republican can talk over whomever and there is no problem? Failed policies? Which ones, without lying?
      Whenever republicans feel slighted they become irate, at least democrats hold their composure, don’t become malicious and have the balls to speak up against the stupidity of the republicans. It is comments such as Conley Brown’s which make me realize how ignorant and easily controllable the US population is. But wait, Biden interrupted Ryan, while he was lying. Therefore Biden MUST be wrong. Right. Lets just forget about everything else he said and focus on a pathetic attempt to undermine the substance of what he had to say.

    • http://www.facebook.com/amy.washburn Amy Washburn

      No, that would be a “Romney.”

    • Siobhan

      Excuses, excuses, excuses…give it up…Biden nailed the debate and spanked that naughty boy Ryan.

    • Ellis J

      Yes, yes. I’m quite sure had Ryan been given an additional 2 minutes to even up the talk time, he would have made all of his lies and his terrible ideas pull together in to a fantastic republican plan to actually improve the state of our nation right now. Oh! If he had only been give two small minutes, we might understand why he wants to eliminate abortion while simultaneously limiting the availability of prenatal care to all women (a lack of which is the #1 reason for infant mortality). 2 minutes would have shed light on all the details we’ve been asking for in his economic plan. Now we may never know how he can advocate war, but claim not to want to engage in it. Oh, but for those two minutes!

      • http://eclectablog.com Eclectablog

        Hah! Great comment!

  • fredb987
    • TDH

      just too give sume perspective, the cnn poll was of all people watching the debate (decided or undecided). The cbs poll was only undecided voters.

      http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-250_162-57531577/who-won-the-vp-debate-why-the-polls-were-so-different/

    • http://www.facebook.com/davidjasonrogers David Rogers

      SPECIAL NOTE OF CAUTION #2: The sample of debate-watchers in this poll were 31% Democratic and 33% Republican. That indicates that the sample of debate watchers is about eight points more Republican than an average CNN poll of all Americans, so the respondents were more Republican than the general public.

  • http://twitter.com/JanetZumba Janet Zumba

    I am sidin’ with Biden

  • Jen Klein

    Wake up sheeple! Biden is a joke and everyone with a brain knows it! The fact he is so close to the presidency is downright scary.

    • http://eclectablog.com Eclectablog

      Yer cute.

    • http://www.facebook.com/nickdrakewhat Nick Drake

      Facts? Oh, never mind….you used the word “sheeple” I don’t expect much from you.

    • Kevin

      “He awoke the sheeple! All is lost!” http://xkcd.com/1013/

      • http://eclectablog.com Eclectablog

        Heh, heh. So perfect. My favorite online comic.

    • Dale Top

      Biden is a brilliant man who will make a great president in 2016 when he is done being VP for his second term. He lost in the primaries to Barack Obama last time, but nobody will beat him next time he runs.

      • http://www.thechurchstateguy.com/ The Church State Guy

        I like Biden, but I’m hoping for Warren 2016.

        • LCForevah

          Alan Grayson/Liz Warren, 2016!

    • Siobhan

      Wow Jen..who’s the “sheepie”.?..I’d say it’s you…Biden was incredible! He wiped the floor with Ryan..Give me an example during that debate of your reason for labeling him a joke..Your comment is laughable..clearly, you were not listening or you’re simply dull of comprehension…that’s what’s scary..that we have so many ignorant Americans in this country..who can only fling it but when asked “why”…just sit there with their mouths wide open…”huh?”

    • K Lacca

      A man with over 30 years of experience in the United States Senate and another 4 as VP is a joke, but a man who serves 4 years as governor (and leaves with an approval rating lower than 47 of the other 50 governors) is a good choice for a president?

  • Eusebius

    You’re delusional.

  • Nick in Florida

    You’re delusional. No wonder you won’t put your real name to this actual drivel. And you’re afraid of any dissenting views because you erased my last post. Don’t have a public blog if you don’t want any real thinkers posting at it. Wuss.

    • http://eclectablog.com Eclectablog

      (a) My name is on every page of this blog and (b) I didn’t delete any comments by you. Period. (c) You’re not particularly observant, are you?

      • http://www.facebook.com/crysalim Chris Riccobono

        I feel sorry for you dude, this is getting linked all over Republican forums (people are being told to come trash this story)

        • http://eclectablog.com Eclectablog

          That’s good to know. Thanks. I have broad shoulders and thick skin so I’m not particularly worried about it ; )

        • Kevin

          I dunno, I’d consider it a bit of an honor if a pack of liars were so offended by his post that they felt the need to verbally assault his blog. :)

          • http://www.facebook.com/barrett.c.johnson Barrett Censored Johnson

            I love how Republicans simply spew insults and parrot random bs slogans they hear to combat actual facts and real points, rather than making any points themselves. “Nick in Florida”, are you aware you didn’t make a single counter-point to argue his story? You simply attacked him personally. What is your excuse for Paul Ryan openly lying and making claims that directly conflict with Romney’s stances?

    • K Lacca

      You’re so right, Nick in Florida. We should never accept someone’s opinions as valid if they don’t publish them under their real name, Nick in Florida.

  • Pingback: The National Memo » How Joe Biden Broke The Gish Gallop

  • Pablo

    Appears many saw Biden as just another laughing hyena in the court of The Lyin’ King

  • Mike Sneed

    AP Wire From Danville, Kentucky. “Joe Biden just asked to meet Dan.” That’s our dumbass VP.

    • http://eclectablog.com Eclectablog

      You realize that Dennis Miller (who originally tweeted that) is a far-right conservative COMEDIAN, right? As in: IT WAS A JOKE???

  • Alex

    If you think that is a proper way to debate. You are clearly in favor of anarchy and chaos and beyond the help of civilized discourse. Biden is a crazy old man. He belittled the office of the Vice President with his antics in the debate. To quote Billy Madison “what you’ve just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have
    ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you
    even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought.
    Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award
    you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.”

    • http://eclectablog.com Eclectablog

      Bwahahahaaa!!! THAT is hilarious!

      Welcome to Eclectablog. What conservative site lead you here?

    • Siobhan

      Chill Alex..you sound like you have a pole up your arse..By the way, Biden’s crazy all right…crazy like a FOX…he was focused, and prepared and he called Ryan on every single line of BS he doled out…Let me guess…are you implying that Romney was civilized or does lying through one’s teeth count? Biden was the clear winner here. in this debate….He used facts to support his assertions and really showed the contrast between the party that favors the hoarders of our country’s wealth and the one that actually cares about the middle class.

  • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100000072642873 Darren Lee

    Ryan needs to work out the arms less and the legs more; I mean, look at those broomsticks!

    • bubbiesbub

      jealous.

    • gffish

      Sippy Ryan needs to spend more time working on his brain and his compassion for others and less time working on his arms.

  • Monica Clark

    Pretentious Liberal Idiots

    JOE BIDEN LIE #1: BIDEN CLAIMED THE WHITE HOUSE DIDN’T KNOW THE LIBYAN EMBASSY WANTED MORE SECURITY

    JOE BIDEN LIE #2: BIDEN CLAIMED THERE WAS NO WASTE OR ABUSE OF STIMULUS MONEY

    JOE BIDEN LIE #3: BIDEN CLAIMED THE ADMISTRATION SAVED MONEY FROM MEDICARE AND PUT IT BACK IN THE PROGRAM

    JOE BIDEN LIE #4: BIDEN CLAIMED OBAMACARE WOULD NOT REQUIRE RELIGIOUS GROUPS TO COVER CONTRACEPTIVES

    JOE BIDEN LIE #5: BIDEN CLAIMED RYAN’S BUDGET CUTS WERE TO BLAME FOR THE LACK OF EMBASSY SECURITY

    JOE BIDEN LIE #6: BIDEN CLAIMED OBAMA ONLY WANTS TO RAISE TAXES ON MILLIONAIRES

    JOE BIDEN LIE #7: BIDEN CLAIMED OBAMA RESCUED THE AUTO INDUSTRY

    • http://eclectablog.com Eclectablog

      On how many sites have you cut and pasted this comment?

    • Dale Top

      That would be wonderful if we lived in an alternate universe where all that was true. Fortunately most of us live in the real world.

    • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1812593024 Linda Osborne
    • Siobhan

      Wow..you’re not very swift are you?

    • http://www.ripitgood.net Calophi

      For lie number 4, actually, what he said was that religious groups would not have to pay extra due to contraceptive coverage and they were not being forced to promote/advertise said coverage to the people they are covering. Therefore their religious freedom is not being infringed upon.

  • Ryan

    As an undecided voter I have to say that I think Biden won the debate. He had more facts and was more straight to the point. However I have to disagree with the whole “laughing at Ryan’s lies was the perfect way to combat it”. To me, an undecided voter, it came off as a little obnoxious. I wanted to hear both sides of the arguments so I can make a smart choice come November and it just got frustrating and difficult to watch with all of his theatrics.

    • http://robobenito.blogspot.com/ Robobenito

      How the hell at this point are you “undecided”. Have you been in space for the last 12 years?

    • http://www.facebook.com/barrett.c.johnson Barrett Censored Johnson

      The idea, in my opinion, was that if you had listened to “both sides”, you would have been hearing LIES. Do you really want lies as a basis for whether or not you want to vote for someone? When you don’t even know they’re lies in the first place? If so, vote Republican! :P

      • Dawn Rainbow

        Their platforms are what tell you what the candidates really stand for.

    • Barry

      You can find their platforms everywhere. If you want to make a “smart” choice, do some research. The only reason you watch a debate over reading an article is for the theatrics. Frankly, you’re just being lazy if you’re trying to decide who to vote for based on a rhetoric filled void of information that is a presidential debate.

      • bubbiesbub

        I’ve never heard anything so idiotic! More than 30% of all media is not true. At a debate, you see the real candidate, even if they misspeak. If you only watch MSMBC or read what’s on the social media, you are not informed. Even if you read something from the government data bank, it may not be true. I even called the government office in charge of graphs and statistics to inform them that an article that quoted them as a source was spinning their data and I wasn’t the only one who called! Read with a grain of salt. Look at the graphs and the parameters. Don’t just believe everything you read. A discriminating scholar is a wise one.

    • bubbiesbub

      a little obnoxious?!?!?!?!?!?!? It was embarrassing and a disgrace to the office of vice president.

      • gffish

        Dick Cheney and Dan Quayle were embarrassments to the office of the vice president.

        • bubbiesbub

          I agree with Dan Quayle, but not Dick Cheney. He’s not who you think he is.

  • http://twitter.com/AndrooMahtin AndrooMahtin

    Biden totally trumped the other dude. The other guy was just repeating slogans and trying to look pretty.

    • bubbiesbub

      Democrats are so ignorant, they don’t even know the name of the next vice president of the United States. They also don’t know how a debate is scored. Incivility brings down your points. Also, did you miss the biggest lie in the entire debate? Of course you did, because you can’t see beyond your own nose. Hint: It has to do with the Libyan 911 massacre, the incompetence of the current administration, and the cover-up for political reasons.

      • mcjeff

        The current and next VP is named Biden. Man you are stupid.

      • lynnnoe

        I didn’t realize that the debates were being scored. I thought (silly me) that we were supposed to learn about the candidates and use that knowledge to make the decision.

  • John Stark

    Luckily most people reading this are too young or ineligible to vote. Put you heads between your legs and kiss your asses goodbye. You are about to be hit by Rpmney tidal wave.

    • Epi topic

      Glad that you can acknowledge that Romney winning would mean devastation for most of us. Too bad that you lack the basic skill level to spellcheck.

    • http://eclectablog.com Eclectablog

      What kind of patronizing POS types a comment like this?

    • http://robobenito.blogspot.com/ Robobenito

      Rp-money, y’all! Whoot whoot!

    • K Lacca

      It’s too bad you don’t need to be able to spell the name of the candidate for whom you are voting.

  • hdh

    Good points dude. Can’t wait to see your thoughts about the next!

  • Catty

    The only thing I’m disappointed about is that Joe didn’t look right at Paul and say ‘that is a blatant lie’ or ‘come on Paul, how stupid do you think Americans are?’ Or at least ‘seriously, quit lying or we can’t have a real debate’. I wanted him to call a spade a spade in no uncertain terms. I guess that would have been “rude” too?

    • Siobhan

      I felt he did that Catty..in his own way..His expressions..smiling in disbelief, chuckling at the absurdity of Ryan’s BS…it was the same as saying what you wished he had said..without actually labeling him a liar..

  • fiddler26

    bravo. i have been wondering all day how anyone could think this asskicking was a Ryan win or a draw

  • Dale Top

    I’ve been saying for years, the best way to debate these liars is to mock them. While pointing out there lies. Why should anybody politely sit by, while they just ramble off things any well informed person knows isn’t true. They have been getting worse every election cycle since Reagan won using the same tactic. It’s about time the Democrats woke up and starting fighting them on a level their uneducated followers can comprehend.

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  • garbageamericaiscrumbling

    Two types of republicans—millionaires and morons.

    • http://www.facebook.com/greg.silva.5 Greg Silva

      that is hilarious

    • http://www.facebook.com/patricia.h.spear Patricia H Spear

      I saw this on HUFF PO——Republicans—–the party of the 1%’s and the “1 toothers”!!!

  • John Q

    LOL – I love arrogant liberals who are so blind as to what happened last night. Joe came across poorly. Jacked up the left but turned off the Independents. Keep it up and you will e whining about President Romney’s policies. ;)

    • http://www.facebook.com/acetech2 Mike McDonald

      Why is it when Romney talked over and down to Obama while ignoring Jim Lehrer, he was being “A forceful leader, but when the tables are turned the other way, Biden was rude and acted poorly?. Keep the rules the same for both sides, eh?

    • Rabid_Liberal

      I would rather be an arrogant liberal for an eternity than a clueless conservative moron for a second.

    • K Lacca

      LOL – I love ignorant people who are so blind to the issues of our society that they pass everything off as liberal or conservative to avoid thinking critically. Your comment came across poorly. Jacked up the hatemongers but turned off the rational thinkers. Keep it up and you will be whining about internet bloggers’ opinions.

      Oh, shit. You’re already doing that.

  • http://www.facebook.com/Yofreidy29 Yofredy Cena

    Alguien sabe con quién competía la UE para que le hayan dado el Nobel de La Paz??

  • brimley

    i think you are going a little overboard with your assessment of Bidens performance. I actually dont think he did enough to upset Ryan. Ryan didnt seem bothered to me and he got to jsut say his bullshit talking points over and over again. Yea, he was “checked” but it was pretty subtle and I bet most people who aren’t Biden fans didn’t even notice.

    • http://www.facebook.com/CathySmith5 Cathy Smith

      The only thing Ryan had going for him, was his ability to “parrot” his talking points. He didn’t have anything else to work with. I especially liked the part when Joe confronted in about what more you would like us to do about Iraq!. Ryan turned white, when Joe asked him straight up, do you want to go to war? Ryan was shucking and diving trying to get himself out of that corner he’s painted himself into. LOL

  • CA Berkeley WV

    Mr. Eclectic: called you an Engergizer Bunny of FaceBook, when a friend posted this link. Hope that’s ok. ;) You and the girl with the camera rock. Hope you find the way to San Jose. Miss you both.

    • CA Berkeley WV

      Oh, shucks, *Energizer*. Cat woke me up too early. And Joey done good, to use a Penn. expression from my grandma.

    • http://eclectablog.com Eclectablog

      Hah! Thanks. California is lovely but I don’t see us getting out there any time soon. Mostly I just want to put up a tent in the woods and sleep : )

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  • Franchot van Slot

    The best section was when Ryan tried to say his plan was bipartisan and Biden said “not one democrat”. And Ryan said the coauthor was a democrat and Biden said “who has said he doesn’t agree with it”. And Ryan said another democrat (paraphrasing) and Biden said “who has disavowed it.” Absolutely priceless and the media hasn’t even mentioned the exchange. A total jewel among presidential debates.

    • bubbiesbub

      You’re wrong: check out Saturday Night Live.

  • buster

    The sad part is that Republicans know their candidates are lying, and they approve. A Repub I know said “Oh he’s just saying that to win” as if it’s a good thing.

    • bubbiesbub

      No, the sad part is that Democrats can’t look beyond themselves, or learn from history, or into the future to realize that Obama does not have their back. He is out to destroy you.

      • Saint_Augustine

        Where I come from what you just posted is called “projection.” Its a very common trait among uninformed conservatards. Are you perhaps a conservatard? A Teaparty member? Or are you uneducated and just plain stupid?

        • bubbiesbub

          True. PROJECTION: an estimate of future possibilities based on a current trend. I’m an Independent for Romney simply because I don’t want 4 more years of this! We need our economic freedom, and we are losing it with the current administration. I’m a social liberal, but social issues must take a back seat to economics. Romney has a better chance of getting us back on track. That has been his business, and he’s good at it. Before you trash Bain Capital, inform yourself. Name calling is typical of ignorant liberals who have no argument. Who did you say was stupid?

          • http://eclectablog.com Eclectablog

            So, you’d rather go back to what we KNOW doesn’t work and, in fact, crashed the economy.
            Right. Got it. That’s a brilliant strategy. [eyeroll]

          • bubbiesbub

            You are misinformed and ignorant. Lowering taxes has historically increased revenues. The highest revenues in the history of the United States were collected after the Bush tax cuts. Go back to school to read what REALLY caused the crash. Bush made mistakes, but this was not one of them. Expecting Romney to be like Bush is irrational. All I know is that we cannot survive another 4 years of this!

          • Dawn Rainbow

            Sure, expecting Myth, who’s running on Bush’s plan, promising all the things Bush promised except more of them, really means he’s NOT like Bush. LOL God you conservturds are such ridiculous idjits.

  • Mary

    I predicted VP Biden was going to be President Obama’s guard dog! He was chosen for his experience and his straight talk. The President did not want to give up his dignity by quarreling, and he was obviously annoyed by the way Romney was changing his position on key issues. All he had to do was keep his cool and wait for Biden to give Ryan enough rope to hang himself. It was beautiful.

  • Concerned American

    Biden is a joke. If you believe anything on this page you really need to wake up and look around you. Biden and Obama lie to your face and you lack the intelligence to know the difference…God help this country if this administration continues….Wake UP people!

    • http://eclectablog.com Eclectablog

      Welcome to Eclectablog. Which conservative site sent you here?

  • concerned american

    what happened to my last post??!!!How biased is this site..lol makes me laugh ….I imagine no one will see this post either….Look at this list..http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_federal_executive_orders
    And in only 4 yrs!!!! WAKE UP PEOPLE

    • http://eclectablog.com Eclectablog

      I’ve only deleted three comments on this post and yours wasn’t one of them. None of them were anti-Obama or anti-Eclectablog.

      Nice try, though. Keep up with the lies and I WILL delete your posts.

  • concerned american

    I challenge all of you to look up the facts on your own. Do you want more gov cheese? Or the opportunity to do for yourself and realize your own dreams………that is what this election boils down to! http://www.audacityofhypocrisy.com/fashion-shows/
    6.) My Name is African Swahili – LIAR, your name is Arabic and ‘Baraka’ (from which Barack came) means ‘blessed’ in that language. Hussein is also Arabic and so is Obama. 7.) I Never Practiced Islam – LIAR, you practiced it daily at school, where you were registered as a Muslim and kept that faith for 31 years,until your wife made you change, so you could run for office. 8.) My School In Indonesia Was Christian – LIAR, you were registered as Muslim there and got in trouble in Koranic Studies for making faces (check your own book). 9.) I Was Fluent In Indonesian – LIAR, not one teacher says you could speak the language. 10.) Because I Lived In Indonesia, I Have More Foreign Experience – LIAR, you were there from the ages of 6 to 10, and couldn’t even speak the language. What did you learn, how to study the Koran and watch cartoons. 11.) I Am Stronger On Foreign Affairs – LIAR, except for Africa (surprise) and the Middle East (bigger surprise), you have never been anywhere else on the planet and thus have NO experience with our closest allies. 12.) I Blame My Early Drug Use On Ethnic Confusion – LIAR, you were quite content in high school to be Barry Obama, no mention of Kenya and no mention of struggle to identify – your classmates said you were just fine. 13.)An Ebony Article Moved Me To Run For Office – LIAR, Ebony has yet to find the article you mention in your book. It doesn’t, and never did, exist. 14.) A Life Magazine Article Changed My Outlook On Life – LIAR, Life has yet to find the article you mention in your book. It doesn’t, and never did, exist. 15.) I Won’t Run On A National Ticket In ‘08 – LIAR, here you are, despite saying, live on TV, that you would not have enough experience by then, and you are all about having experience first. 16.) Present Votes Are Common In Illinois – LIAR, they are common for YOU, but not many others have 130 NO VOTES. 17.) Oops, I Misvoted – LIAR, only when caught by church groups and democrats, did you beg to change your misvote. 18.) I Was A Professor Of Law – LIAR, you were a senior lecturer ON LEAVE. 19.) I Was A Constitutional Lawyer – LIAR, you were a senior lecturer ON LEAVE. 20.) Without Me, There Would Be No Ethics Bill – LIAR, you didn’t write it,introduce it, change it, or create it. 21.) The Ethics Bill Was Hard To Pass – LIAR, it took just 14 days from start to finish. 22.) I Wrote A Tough Nuclear Bill – LIAR, your bill was rejected by your own party for its pandering and lack of all regulation – mainly because of your Nuclear Donor, Exelon, from which David Axelrod came. 23.) I Have Released My State Records – LIAR, as of March, 2008, state bills you sponsored or voted for have yet to be released, exposing all the special interests pork hidden within. 24.) I Took On The Asbestos Altgeld Gardens Mess – LIAR, you were part of a large group of people who remedied Altgeld Gardens. You failed to mention anyone else but yourself, in your books. 25.) My Economics Bill Will Help America – LIAR, your 111 economic policies were just combined into a proposal which lost 99-0, and even YOU voted against your own bill. 26.) I Have Been A Bold Leader In Illinois – LIAR, even your own supporters claim to have not seen BOLD action on your part. 27.) I Passed 26 Of My Own Bills In One Year – LIAR, they were not YOUR bills, but rather handed to you, after their creation by a fellow Senator, to assist you in a future bid for higher office. 28.) No One Contacted Canada About NAFTA – LIAR, the Candian Government issued the names and a memo of the conversation your campaign had with them. 29.) I Am Tough On Terrorism – LIAR, you missed the Iran Resolution vote on terrorism and your good friend Ali Abunimah supports the destruction of Israel. 30.) I Am Not Acting As President Yet – LIAR, after the NAFTA Memo, a dead terrorist in the FARC, in Colombia, was found with a letter stating how you and he were working together on getting FARC recognized officially. 31.) I Didn’t Run Ads In Florida – LIAR, you allowed national ads to run 8-12 times per day for two weeks – and you still lost. 32.) I Won Michigan – LIAR, no you didn’t. 33.) I won Nevada – LIAR, no you did not. 34.) I Want All Votes To Count – LIAR, you said let the delegates decide. 35.) I Want Americans To Decide – LIAR, you prefer caucuses that limit the vote, confuse the voters, force a public vote, and only operate during small windows of time. 36.) I passed 900 Bills in the State Senate – LIAR, you passed 26, most of which you didn’t write yourself. 37.) My Campaign Was Extorted By A Friend – LIAR, that friend is threatening to sue if you do not stop saying this. Obama has stopped saying this. 38.) I Believe In Fairness, Not Tactics – LIAR, you used tactics to eliminate Alice Palmer from running against you. 39.) I Don’t Take PAC Money – LIAR, you take loads of it. 40.) I don’t Have Lobbysists – LIAR, you have over 47 lobbyists, and counting. 41.) My Campaign Had Nothing To Do With The 1984 Ad – LIAR, your own campaign worker made the ad on his Apple in one afternoon. 42.) My Campaign Never Took Over MySpace – LIAR, Tom, who started MySpace issued a warning about this advertising to MySpace clients. 43.) I Inspire People With My Words – LIAR, you inspire people with other people’s words. 44.) I Have Passed Bills In The U.S. Senate – LIAR, you have passed A BILL in the U.S. Senate – for Africa, which shows YOUR priorities. 45.) I Have Always Been Against Iraq – LIAR, you weren’t in office to vote against it AND you have voted to fund it every single time, unlike Kucinich, who seems to be out gutting you Obama. You also seem to be stepping back from your departure date – AGAIN. 46.) I Have Always Supported Universal Health Care – LIAR, your plan leaves us all to pay the 15,000,000 who don’t have to buy it. 47.) I Only Found Out About My Investment Conflicts Via Mail – LIAR, both companies you site as having sent you letters about this conflict have no record of any such letter ever being created or sent. 48.) I Am As Patriotic As Anyone – LIAR, you won’t wear a flag pin and you don’t put your hand over your heart during the Anthem. 49.) My Wife Didn’t Mean What She Said About Pride In Country – LIAR, your wife’s words follow lock-step in the vein of Wright and Farrahkan, in relation to their contempt and hatred of America. 50.) Wal-Mart Is A Company I Wouldn’t Support – LIAR, your wife has received nearly a quater of a million dollars through Treehouse, which is connected to Wal-Mart. 51.) Treehouse Is A Small Company – LIAR, the CEO of Treehouse last year, made more than the CEO of Wal-Mart, according to public records. 52.) University Of Chicago Hospital Pay Is Fair – LIAR, your wife’s pay raise was nearly 150% her already bloated rate and the hospital is a Non-Profit Hospital, which made $100,000,000 in the last 3 years. They overcharge blacks VS whites for services, and overcharge everyone in general by 538%! 53.)I Barely Know Rezko – Only 5 Billed Hours – LIAR, you have known him for 17 years, and decided to do a real estate deal with him during a time when he was proven to be under investigation. Despite this, you divided your property and had them take off $300K before the mortgage problems started. Then Rezko’s wife buys the lot beside it that you can’t afford, saving you $625,000. 54.) My Donations Have Been Checked Thoroughly – LIAR, you only gave back Hsu ($72K) and Rezko (first $66K, then when caught lying $86K, then when caught lying again $150K and now caught lying YET AGAIN OBAMA, it’s $250k) their money when publically called on their involvement in your campaigns. 55.) My Church Is Like Any Other Christian Church – LIAR, your church is so extreme, the pastor who married you, Rev. Wright, just got done blaming the US for 9/11 and named Louis Farrahkan their person of the year. 56.) I Disagree With My Church All The Time – LIAR, you still have yet to repudiate Wright, who married you and your wife, and you still donate large sums of money to assist the church in furthering its message – hatred and revenge. You donated in 2006 alone, $22,500 to the church that you so terribly disagree with. That is nearly $500 PER WEEK – that sure is disagreement, Senator Obama. 57.) I Have Clean Connections Despite Rezko – LIAR, you are not only connected to Exelon and Rezko, you are also connected to Hillary PAC supporter Mr. Hsu, AND an Iraqi Billionaire of ill repute, Nadhmi Auchi, who ripped off people in the Food For Oil, Iraqi deal. Seems Mr. Auchi may have helped Obama buy his million dollar property long before Obama had millions of dollars. Wonder what favors Mr. Auchi expects, when Obama leaves Iraq free to be taken over by special interests such as him. 58.) I never heard sermons like Rev. Wright’s, that have been in videos all day, You Tube – LIAR! 3 days later during your Mea Culpa BS speech you said “Did I hear controversial statements while I sat in that church? Yes I did.” 59.) The Passport Invasion is a conspiracy to find dirt on me! – LIAR. Your own Campaign Foreign Policy Advisor is the CEO of the company that looked into your records. PS – You had them look into yours to hide the fact you looked into Clinton’s and McCain’s more than a year before! 60.) Rev. Meeks has nothing to do with my campaigning – LIAR. Rev. Meeks appeared in ads for your Senate Campaign, donated to you, and helped raise money, then AND NOW. PS – He also seems to despise America. 61.) My wife didn’t mean America is ignorant, she was just using a phrase – LIAR. Again, MicHELLe’s comments perfectly sync with Wright’s, Meeks’, and Farrakhans, both in language, anger, and direction. 62.) I am very Anti-Terror – LIAR. [03/30/2008] One of your good pals is long time radical and terrorist William Ayers, with whom you have been seen in the last 12 months and who has helped the now jailed khalidi, Professor at Columbia who invited Ahmadinejad to the University, to raise money for Palestinian terrorism attacks against Israel. PS – Your church published a pro Hamas Manifesto – guess you weren’t there on THAT Sunday either? How lucky for you. This is the LAUNDRY LIST OF LIES. Updated to reflect new dishonesties.

    • Saint_Augustine

      Its sad that Ronald Reagan emptied out the mental facilities, you would fit in so well at one!

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  • J

    Uncle Joe showed the punk the door….

  • Benny

    ” Dude totally got Bidened…”

    That sums it up.

  • Disgusted

    To “Biden” someone is certainly amusing to the public, but it violates the basic premise of a debate: polite, moderated conversation between two or more sides. This was in no way polite or respectful, neither to Ryan, nor to the moderator. It takes power away from both of those parties and puts it solely into the hands of the aggressor, which is not the way that debates are *supposed* to function.

    Just to head off some (but I know not many) of the trolls, I am NOT a republican, nor can I find a *single* item that Romney and Ryan have ever said which I wholeheartedly agree with. I simply believe in decorum.

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  • Youareallmorons

    Biden is a fucking moron just like all liberals.

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